Q: Okay. In the last three years, has Mr. Brauer ever expressed to you dissatisfaction with the way his program has been treated by the City of Lakewood as being a reason for dropping any apartments?On discussions of what role race played in the city's actions toward the youth re-entry program:
A: During the period of time that Mayor George was in office, we had those kind of discussions. Since the new mayor took over, we have not had those discussions.
A: We had some conversations with Mark Brauer on whether they were going to continue to sign leases with us in light of what the City of Lakewood was doing to their tenants. And, you know, these were answered a long time ago. And as it played out, they ended up continuing to renew leases partly because the new mayor has not continued this program to try to get rid of Youth Re-Entry as Mayor George did.
Q: How did the racial makeup of the YRP clients enter into that conversation [with LMM]?On his understanding of where the city wanted LMM to relocate to:
A: We had a discussion that the City of Lakewood was targeting their program because they didn't want blacks in the City of Lakewood on Clifton Boulevard in a predominant spot in the city.
Q: Who expressed that opinion?
A: I did.
Q: What is it that led you to this conclusion or opinion?
A: Well, taking it in the context that you have a fully-renovated apartment with brand-new kitchens, brand-new appliances, all new electrical systems, all new windows, a new parking lot, new landscaping, everything brand-new, and the city thinks it's necessary to get the health department, the building department, the fire department and the police department to all raid it at the same time. Not only that, but out of 97 units, they only go in the black kids' units, the two buildings that are occupied by the Youth Re-Entry Program. Talk about target invasion. They systematically went through the apartments of every black resident in our complex and left the other two buildings completely alone. That's the conclusion that I draw.
Q: In fact, Mayor George's suggestion that YRP may want to think about different quarters proved unsuccessful, correct?On his request for punitive damages:
A: Correct. But I do know that he wanted them to move to another part of Lakewood, which is the only other part of town in Lakewood that's predominantly African American.
Q: Where was that?
A: I think it's somewhere on Madison or Detroit.
Q: Okay. And then you've also listed punitive damages in the amount of $5 million.On some unsuccessful efforts to sell Hidden Village:
A: Well, Michael Priore and I determined that the market was at its peak. At that time, in 2006, the Cleveland area was flooded with California buyers that were paying very large amounts of money for buildings in Cleveland because a building that would sell for, you know, $50 or $60,000 a suite in Cleveland would be $150,000 in LA. And Bridge Partners had a program where they brought people in from the West Coast to buy properties. And we originally, you know, came up with our business plan that we would sell as many buildings as we could at these high values. And in accordance with that plan, Michael and I owned five buildings together in Lakewood. We put them all up for sale. And we were successful in selling three of the five buildings.
Q: Why did those letters of intent not result in a sale, if you know?
A: Well, some of them didn't result in a sale because they offered too little money.
Q: Okay.
A: Some of them resulted in a -- resulted in the potential buyer walking away because they were concerned about the City of Lakewood issue and the Lutheran Re-Entry Program.
Q: Do you recall who those buyers were?
A: The names are on the letters of intent.
On who is initial Lakewood city contact was with:Q: What is it that attracted YRP to the Lakewood area?
A: Primarily -- there were several things. We wanted to get out of the neighborhood that we were in because it was deleterious to the young people that we served. They found themselves getting into more trouble because of those who were in the neighborhood. That was one reason.
The second was that the complex at Hidden Village -- because of the efficiency units that were available there, were something that we wanted because it was going to allow each one of our participants to have his or her own unit, and that, because of some of the issues that they had behaviorally and in their backgrounds, living with others in the same apartment caused difficulty. So this was a way to diminish and reduce that.
Q: What kind of problems did you run into with roommates?
A: Some you would expect from any teenager who would have to share the same space with each other. Problems, for example, somebody saying someone stole someone's iPod or their game system, you know. That sort of thing. "What happened to my shoes? Somebody stole my shoes." So by having their own unit, where they are responsible and there was no one else in there and it was gone, then it was no one's fault but their own because no one was in there.
A: I believe it was the health department, if I'm not mistaken, of Lakewood, because I knew an individual who worked there who had previously been on my board and said that if I wanted to -- before we did anything with regards to signing a lease and indicating in any concrete way we were going to move to Lakewood, that I wanted to sit down with city officials and talk to them about that and establish a relationship with them and begin that in order to have a good relationship with them. So I began with that person, who turned -- her name was Mary Hall.On why progam members could not unlock their own apartment doors:
Q: Okay. During non-curfew hours, could the clients leave, come and go at will, or did they have to sign in and sign out or check in with anybody or anything like that?On his interaction with Councilperson Mary Louise Madigan:
A: They would have had to check in with the case managers when they would come back from somewhere because they were able to lock their own apartments, but the case managers had to let them into their apartments or another staff person would have had to let them in.
Q: And was that to maintain some control over what the clients were up to?
A: Yes. Not so much for the individual whose apartment was locked and needed to be open, but relative to the activities of other individuals so that we were sure that we knew that they were back, and then that way we also knew that the apartment was locked when they came back and had been locked while they were gone, in case there were any accusations that somebody stole somebody's game system.
Q: Did Mary Louise Madigan ever express frustration or disappointment with the way the city was responding to you?
A: The only thing that I recall was with regard to communication with her. There may have been, for example, a meeting that was set up at one point that they didn't tell her about. And she expressed some frustration about that. I don't recall anything else.
Q: Do you remember that meeting with Nicole DeSario?On if the program is operating differently now versus how it was being operated in the past:
A: I do.
Q: Tell me what that meeting entailed.
A: I believe that she may have indicated the parties that she was speaking directly to on that visit to Cleveland. And I don't recall all of whom, but she did layout the parties with whom she was to be speaking. And then I believe she told us about what the process would be for whether or not the Department of Justice would continue further, and I don't recall what that -- the appropriate terminology for what that would mean. It's my understanding that this is an initial investigation of some sort. And following the initial investigation, there would be a decision as to whether or not to do whatever they would do in the next step or not do it. She laid out kind of a time line for that to occur. That's all of what I recall from that meeting.
Q: Taking you back, then, to that time frame of October of 2007, when you spoke to her in July of 2008 when you met with her, did you express to Nicole DeSario your belief that the treatment of the YRP program was motivated, in part, by race or racial demographic of the program?
A: I don't recall.
Q: Were you supportive at that juncture of an investigation into whether the civil rights of the YRP residents was being violated by the City of Lakewood?
A: Well, was I supportive? By that do you mean, did I think it was okay or did I express support to someone?
Q: Did you think it was warranted at that juncture?
A: I was not opposed to it.
Q: At any point in time under Mayor George's tenure at the City of Lakewood, did you feel welcomed by the City of Lakewood?
A: I cannot say that we ever did.
Q: But have there been any operational changes in your program, other than you meeting with Edward Fitzgerald, that would explain why this
relationship with the City of Lakewood has improved?
A: Nothing of substance. You know, we did at some point -- I believe, the October meeting of '06mentions that we were going to put in the cameras. So that helped us to be a little more self-policing, for example, that might have cut down on some of the activity of the kids that might have resulted in fewer response calls by the police, but nothing major.
Q: So basically the program is run the same way now as it was when you first moved in?
A: Yes.
Q: And nobody is telling you that there is some inordinate amount of police activity around Hidden Village at this juncture?
A: No.
Q: What was the problem with the location?
A: It was crowded. We had several youth in one apartment. It wasn't the best neighborhood. There was a lot of drug activity and a lot of crime in that neighborhood. We had our youth spread out, it wasn't ideal for the type of programming we were delivering. We had several buildings on different ends of the street.
Q: Were you encountering difficulties with your clients becoming involved with people who were engaged in criminal activities in the area?
A: Occasionally.
Q: I'm asking this: Was there a problem with YRP clientele getting caught up with criminal activities surrounding the East 100 Street address?
A: It wasn't the best influence. They had easy access to alcohol. There was a store in the neighborhood that would sell alcohol to underage people, like our clients. It wasn't so much that our clients were involved in the crime, it was just the environment. There was a lot of crime in the environment. There was known drug activity on the street.
A: You know, that would be kind of difficult to track just because we had more space when we moved to Hidden Village. We were a little more selective in who we brought into the program over at Hidden Village. The setup was different. On 100 street, we had sometimes five residents in one unit, which could lead to domestic issues and fighting.
Q: Can you give me some examples of the issues that your clientele were facing during 2006, 2007 at the Hidden Village address, the types of legal issues?
A: I know there were thefts. There was a situation where a client tried to attack another client with a knife. There were some parole violations.
A: Child care workers' responsibilities are to remain on-sight during an assigned shift. They have certain tasks that they do. They have keys to the units. They walk through every apartment on every hour to two hours to monitor what's going on. They facilitate some life skill classes and they document what they see.On why program members don't have a key to their own locked rooms:
Q: So the residents don't keep their own key?On if any of the eight efficiency apartment being used as office space are also used for programming purposes:
A: No.
Q What's the reason for that?
A Because they can lose their keys. They can bring unauthorized visitors into their apartment. It's a good way to see them and make contact when they return from an appointment or school or whatever.
Q: You were quoted on a number of places, among others, on the third paragraph of page 2 and there you say that you and your staff use the offices only and that any programming or educational classes are offered in the individual's own suites. Is that a correct rendition, that your offices are not used for programming or meeting purposes?On Councilperson Mary Louis Madigan's interest in the program:
A: At the time they were not.
Q: And now they are some?
A: On occasion they have been.
A: I can't remember the dates, if it was within the time frame. But I know Ms. Madigan stepped out on several occasions to visit the program and we had some brief conversations.On having having fewer juvenile felons in the program:
Q: Can you tell me about those visits with Ms. Madigan?
A: I can't recall in detail what they were about. She would frequently jog in the area and she would stop in to say hello to see if everything was okay.
Q: Were those unwelcomed visits in any way? I mean, were they unwelcomed by you or other members of the program?
A: They were unannounced, but they weren't unwelcomed.
Q: Were you aware that Councilwoman Madigan saw the women in jail for the purpose to verify the crimes committed by YRP?
A: Yes.
Q: How did that come to your attention?
A: I think she told me, actually.
Q: Was she a supporter of the YRP program?
A: I don't know if support is the word. I don't think she was opposed to us being there, but I know she definitely kept an eye on us. Like I said, she would frequently walk through. So I don't know if supporter or -- she really seemed neutral.
Q: You mentioned at one time some of YRP's clientele came from juveniles who were being released or people being released from custody of the Ohio Department of Youth Services?
A: Yes.
Q: And that is no longer the case?
A: No, it's not the case anymore.
Q: When did that relationship end?
A: In 2009.
Q: What brought that about?
A: We were actually outbid on a contract.
Q: As of when in 2009 was that, do you know?
A: I believe that contract ended June 30th, 2009.
Q: Were clientele who came to you from ODYS mmediately taken out of the program when the contract ended or were there grandfathered people, so to speak, just continue on until they were done?
A: No. They actually left at the end of the contract.
Q: Can you give us an idea of your observations concerning the relationship between the City of Lakewood now, as opposed to say, for instance, in the spring of 2007?
A: Sure. It's much better. We have a relationship with Officer Fritch who has frequently visited our program to check in and see how things were going. When we first moved in, the first couple years we had involvement with the police, it was negative. We've provided -- I think I said this before -- copies of tapes that the city has needed if there were other crimes in the area. We've met with the current mayor a couple of times.
Q: Do you have any complaints about the present state of the relationship between YRP and the City of Lakewood?
A: No.